Squaw Valley concidering a name change

[Benski]

Some Native American Tribes consider the word a slur for a Native American woman, but not the Algonquin, so I don't think anyone is coming for Big Squaw.

https://www.tetongravity.com/story/news/squaw-valley-is-considering-renaming-to-remove-racial-slur

[JimK]

Quote

 

The recent police protests and demonstrations for social justice have really brought these kind of issues to the fore.  As an older person who grew up in the Wash DC area I have been a fan of the Redskins for over 50 years.   It's probably been over 25 years since significant objections were first raised about the name of our football team.  Back then I thought changing the name was a ridiculous idea.  I and most Redskins fans always interpreted the name to mean a brave warrior who was ready to fight as hard as possible to win their battles.  I viewed it as celebrating courageous Native Americans, not denigrating them. 

As a corollary, I am of Irish descent.  I like the nickname for the Univ of Notre Dame sports teams.  The Fighting Irish mascot represents determination, feistiness, and a nice touch of humor.  I think it also refers to the historical fact that as one of the foremost early catholic colleges in America many Irish catholic immigrants sought to send their children there and/or were predisposed to root for the school's sports teams.

Back to Redskins and Squaw Valley, in recent years I've become more amenable to a name change for the Redskins.  Supposedly, our team owner polled Native American groups a couple years ago and they mostly still liked the name.  But if you tell me most Native Americans are now offended by the word Redskin or the word Squaw, then go ahead and change it.  It's a little thing.  We have bigger things to worry about.  I am a fan of social justice and the Golden Rule, but I am not a big fan of careless political correctness so these things should be addressed sensibly and fairly and not with knee-jerk reactions.  It sounds like a very easy name change for Squaw Valley is to call it Olympic Valley, which is a term commonly used in the region already. 

[Benski]

@jimk I agree and I don’t know how trustworthy the redskins survey is. I just worry being to quick to accept a term as racist could blow harmless miss understanding into scandals and increase the amount of offended people. I think it would be great if words like Redskin, Squaw or N@$& could be clearly sanitized.

[Machski]

Squaw Valley and Alpine Meadows should be linked soon with a new base to base gondola, so just call the whole thing Alpine Meadows Olympic Valley and be done with it.  Or maybe Tahoe Olympic Valleys.

[JimK]

Interesting, looks like Redskins might now change their name.  After years of resisting the change the team owner just signaled today, 3 July 20, that they are taking a hard look at it.  Some of their big sponsors like FEDEX and NIKE have requested a change - or else.  

I just googled the large list of other sports teams that had Indian-related names and what happened to them.  Not only have most changed the sports teams nicknames away from Indian, Brave, Chief, etc., but many of these teams/schools have also dropped logos that depicted Native Americans in any way.  I'm ok with dropping the term Redskin, but that last part is kind of sad to me because I always thought the Redskins had a noble, strong and inspiring Indian logo that I hope they can keep:

Maybe change team name to Washington Warriors and keep everything else the same, or would that still be objectionable???

Question, is wearing this old jersey now the equivalent of flying a Confederate flag outside your house

I really don't want to be targeted as a racist.

 

Edited July 3, 2020 by JimK

[Machski]

Mark the Cleveland Indians down as the next sports franchise to consider changing their name.  Will the KC Chiefs consider it too?

[JimK]

I can see being offended by the term "Redskin", but those that don't like Indian team names seem to want all branding connected with Native American heritage eliminated?  That seems a shame to me, but I guess they view it as exploitive or cartoonish?  Sad.

FYI: 

The Washington Post, which has argued that the Redskins name is a slur, found in a 2016 poll of Native Americans that only 9% of the Native American community polled found the name offensive. A less scientific poll from 2019 found that the most common emotion associated with the name was “pride.”

That quote came from this article on the subject which suggests that all Indian team names will be gone soon:  https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/the-renaming-wont-stop-with-the-washington-redskins

Edited July 7, 2020 by JimK

[Benski]

5 hours ago, JimK said:

I can see being offended by the term "Redskin", but those that don't like Indian team names seem to want all branding connected with Native American heritage eliminated?  That seems a shame to me, but I guess they view it as exploitive or cartoonish?  Sad.

FYI: 

The Washington Post, which has argued that the Redskins name is a slur, found in a 2016 poll of Native Americans that only 9% of the Native American community polled found the name offensive. A less scientific poll from 2019 found that the most common emotion associated with the name was “pride.”

That quote came from this article on the subject which suggests that all Indian team names will be gone soon:  https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/the-renaming-wont-stop-with-the-washington-redskins

That's the Washington Examiner, not the Washington Post, big difference. The Examiner is 15 years old, published by a homophobic, climate denying, antiabortion activist.

[JimK]

I think the 2016 poll was conducted by the Wash Post, but cited in the 2020 Wash Examiner article.  

The Post is about as far left as the Examiner is far right.  I take both of them with a grain of salt.

[Machski]

Read an editorial piece in USA today that wasn't even accepting of them changing the Skins to the Warriors.  Main objection?  White fans still might/would show up dressed in. Active American attire.  Where will this all end?  This country is on the verge of becoming quite boring and monochrome.

[Puck it]

The Texas Rangers are also on the list for name changes due to their brutality in the past per another atricle.

 

This country is screwed up.

[Jully]

On 7/8/2020 at 6:10 PM, Machski said:

Read an editorial piece in USA today that wasn't even accepting of them changing the Skins to the Warriors.  Main objection?  White fans still might/would show up dressed in. Active American attire.  Where will this all end?  This country is on the verge of becoming quite boring and monochrome.

I mean the point of the name change would hopefully be to change behavior to stop mocking Native Americans. Thus, it'd be kind of silly to change the name to something and still have the fans do the same behavior. If you're going to do something, don't do it halfway.

I personally would rather see it stay the same or changed to something that would stop all the behavior that some view as offensive. Otherwise this conversation just continues endlessly. A key example is the Cleveland Indians eliminating the logo but keeping the name a few years ago. People are still angry on both sides! I'd like to not have these arguments about our sports teams in 2025 or 2035.

[frapcap]

Can't we celebrate that the origin of these logos and names weren't to offend, but to admire? Hence why they're in there in sports. BLOOD! GUTS! WE AIN'T NO BITCH ASS TEAM NAMED AFTER A BIRD! WE'RE GODDAMNED GERINOMO! 

[Machski]

8 hours ago, Jully said:

I mean the point of the name change would hopefully be to change behavior to stop mocking Native Americans. Thus, it'd be kind of silly to change the name to something and still have the fans do the same behavior. If you're going to do something, don't do it halfway.

I personally would rather see it stay the same or changed to something that would stop all the behavior that some view as offensive. Otherwise this conversation just continues endlessly. A key example is the Cleveland Indians eliminating the logo but keeping the name a few years ago. People are still angry on both sides! I'd like to not have these arguments about our sports teams in 2025 or 2035.

Well, warriors is the leading new name.  The team has stated they would keep their colors but the Indian image would be gone.  Not sure what the new logo would look like, don't think they have indicated anything.  Even if you change the name to "Washington Powder Puffs" and change the colors to pink, long time fans will likely still show up in classic team gear/dress.  Go-to a Carolina Hurricanes game, guarantee you will still see green Hartford Whalers sweaters amongst the crowd.  Traditions die hard.  If Washington is to scrub fans from dressing in now non-appropriate gear, they will have to not admit them or remove them if they change inside the gate. 

[Benski]

Well, warriors is the leading new name.  The team has stated they would keep their colors but the Indian image would be gone.  Not sure what the new logo would look like, don't think they have indicated anything.  Even if you change the name to "Washington Powder Puffs" and change the colors to pink, long time fans will likely still show up in classic team gear/dress.  Go-to a Carolina Hurricanes game, guarantee you will still see green Hartford Whalers sweaters amongst the crowd.  Traditions die hard.  If Washington is to scrub fans from dressing in now non-appropriate gear, they will have to not admit them or remove them if they change inside the gate. 

The Hartford Whalers gear has a cult fallowing. I don’t think any other team has close to there success selling throwbacks gear

[JimK]

1 hour ago, Benski said:

The Hartford Whalers gear has a cult fallowing. I don’t think any other team has close to there success selling throwbacks gear

My buddy next to me is a member of the cult.  He grew up in CT, then moved south.  He's an excellent skier and also still plays rec league hockey at age 60.  BTW, that photo is from a few years ago at Timberline, WV, the place that was recently bought by Perfect North and is being resurrected this summer with new lifts, new snowmaking and lots of repairs after old owners went bust and did not open last winter.  Pretty good mountain and fairly snowy for the Mid-Atlantic.

[JimK]

I visited the Great Salt Lake today.  The lake is not everyone's cup of tea, but after a bike ride on nearby roads I enjoy sitting in a beach chair with my toes in the water.  There was a light breeze today and temps about 88 degs.  It's not a bad substitute for a day at the ocean.  SLC is 600 miles from the Pacific:-)

I noticed my old NFL sticker on my car is splitting in half from the elements and appears to form the "no-mascots" symbol.   I'm pulling for the new name to be the Washington Red Wolves so I can hear 70,000 fans howl like a wolf when we score a touchdown.

 

This looks like ice, but it's dried salt and even cracks when you step on it.  In the height of summer with evaporation the shoreline recedes about a quarter mile.  The GSL is 75 miles long and 25 miles wide.

Ant hill foreground, Antelope Island background.

 

Edited July 14, 2020 by JimK

[Cannonballer]

On 7/8/2020 at 6:10 PM, Machski said:

Read an editorial piece in USA today that wasn't even accepting of them changing the Skins to the Warriors.  Main objection?  White fans still might/would show up dressed in. Active American attire.  Where will this all end?  This country is on the verge of becoming quite boring and monochrome.

"Active American attire"?   Do you mean like spandex and bike shorts?

[JimK]

New allegations of extensive work place harassment levied on Washington's NFL team.

[Machski]

On 7/15/2020 at 5:55 PM, Cannonballer said:

"Active American attire"?   Do you mean like spandex and bike shorts?

No, was suppose to say Native American, damn auto correct.