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On 6/1/2017 at 9:43 AM, Puck it said:

The pic that I posted says it is her but not sure.

 

On 6/1/2017 at 9:36 AM, Cannonballer said:

Pauline Ferrand Prevot...

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1405450-30105647-2560-1440.jpg?w=1050

MMMMMM! Cyclocross!

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32 minutes ago, SallyCat said:

Really, NMS? Pinup pictures of scantily-clad female athletes and comments about which ones you want to "mount"?

WTF?

 

 

Yup, and no said anything to the likes of what you are saying.  

So, start a Men of MTB thread.

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1 hour ago, Puck it said:

So, start a Men of MTB thread.

Roger that.  I wouldn't demean male athletes by sexualizing their physical appearance, though. 

I appreciate the kind and helpful feedback I've received here on NMS and wish the site the best as it grows in both readers and content. 

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Roger that.  I wouldn't demean male athletes by sexualizing their physical appearance, though. 
I appreciate the kind and helpful feedback I've received here on NMS and wish the site the best as it grows in both readers and content. 
Agreed. As a mountain biker (whose primary riding partner is a woman) I don't find anything sexual about mountain biking. I do however have a huge amount of respect and admiration for the skills and the super fit physiques of male and female mountain bikers (and athletes in general).

Most of the photos in this thread show top athletes riding really hard. There are also some photos in this thread that show a fair amount of skin. When I look at those I don't see sex I see powerful athletes. I guess that's the subjective nature of photographs, we all take from them what we want.

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2 hours ago, Cannonballer said:

Most of the photos in this thread show top athletes riding really hard. There are also some photos in this thread that show a fair amount of skin. When I look at those I don't see sex I see powerful athletes. I guess that's the subjective nature of photographs, we all take from them what we want.

Indeed, photos are subjective. For example, when I look at this photo of a woman wearing full makeup and taking her clothes off in a Flashdance-style rain storm that was taken from an article called "The World's Hottest Pro Cyclist," and that wouldn't be out of place on the front page of PornHub, I see a powerful athlete, too.  But I see a one whose athleticism is being deliberately diminished by a media culture that thinks the only way the general public will value female athletes is as objects of sexual attraction.  Frankly, that's insulting not just to the athletes, but to their fans, as well. 

315201988_WomenofMTBPic4.jpg.a1773cf8428c28af32ba87e02721e510.jpg

Edited by SallyCat
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Indeed, photos are subjective. For example, when I look at this photo of a woman wearing full makeup and taking her clothes off in a Flashdance-style rain storm that was taken from an article called "The World's Hottest Pro Cyclist," and that wouldn't be out of place on the front page of PornHub, I see a powerful athlete, too.  But I see a one whose athleticism is being deliberately diminished by a media culture that thinks the only way the general public will value female athletes is as objects of sexual attraction.  Frankly, that's insulting not just to the athletes, but to their fans, as well. 315201988_WomenofMTBPic4.jpg.a1773cf8428c28af32ba87e02721e510.jpg

 

I don't disagree with any of that. But I would add a few points of context to the discussion. 

1) You picked 1 post out of almost 60 in this thread to take issue with. It doesn't make that 1 post any better, but you glossed over the much more common type like this one that is a specific pic and discussion of a woman succeeding in the MTB circuit.

 

2) you're giving the female athletes no agency in these photos. That photo of Koerber Rockwell that you referenced is not some leaked private photo. It's something that she chose to do and be a part of and market. It's not my thing, but I wouldn't presume to tell her that she is insulting herself and her fans.

 

3) you're not changing the trajectory of this thread for he better, you're setting it back and making 'sexualization' the point of it. I suggest you read back through this thread from the beginning and see the trajectory of it. It started with some non-riding images of women cyclists. It then took a turn towards hard-core riding shots and discussion of the women's MTB circuit. You could have easily aided in advancing that trajectory by posting some more awesome women-on-MTB pics. You could have even contributed some of your own MTB experiences (I assume you ride or you wouldn't have bothered with this thread in the first place). You could have easily disproved the trend that "the only way the general public will value female athletes is as objects of sexual attraction" by posting some jaw-drpping pics of female athletes killing it in their sport (that's what I did throughout this thread). Instead you chose to pick out some of the rare and early-entries from this thread that you found offensive and bring them to the forefront instead of helping to squash them. Now that's what the thread is about. Which is a shame because I really liked the other track it was on.

 

4) you called out all of NMS in your first post. If there were specific posts or posters you have an issue with address them directly. Don't imply that the entire site and everyone on it is somehow a problem. We don't need more babysitting in the world, we need more open and honest dialogue.

 

 

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"We need more open and honest dialogue" but also I shouldn't talk about one third of this thread because you want to pretend it doesn't exist? Because it took place in that ancient time period of one year ago?

Also, I said that media culture was insulting to female athletes, not the individual athlete's decisions, which take place within and are shaped by that culture along with more blunt economic considerations such as sponsorships. It does not diminish a person's agency to note that the context in which that agency is able to be deployed is constrained. 

I called out NMS because those words and pictures have been sitting there for a year and nobody contradicted them. Nobody asked why Puck-it and others were posting pictures of bikers that had nothing to do with biking. And yeah, I also happened upon the thread with photos of women at the starting tents of ski race and a bunch of NMS posters are commenting on the women's asses. The couple of people who tried to speak up about it were shouted down**, so I'm not seeing much in the way of open and honest dialogue here. 

I thought this place was supposed to be a better version of AZ or something; I haven't been around enough to totally understand the issues there, but I was rooting for this place to succeed. But this demographic really says a lot. Well over 40% of skiers are women, but this is a pretty typical demographic breakdown of participationon ski forums, and that means that your open and honest dialogue is really missing an awful lot of voices. I wonder why that is?  

Anyway, I gotta run and I won't likely be back here; it's just not my cup of tea, but I wasn't much of a poster anyway, so who cares. 

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**EDIT: Sorry, I got AZ and NMS confused there, probably because there wasn't much difference. The ass shots were on AZ, but there were plenty of equally-charmless pics and comments on NMS. 

 

Edited by SallyCat

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@SallyCat I'm not going to dig into your last post other than to say I agree with some of it and disagree with some of it.  It's a conversation I'd be happy to have. But my experience with discussions like this, on forums like this, is that they don't really go anywhere.  Nobody is changing anyone's minds and after a few back-and-forths the discussion devolves. There's no point in going there.

I'm sorry to see you go.  Obviously I think it would be much better if you stayed and were a strong contributor of the type of content that you want to see.  Expanding the demographic and the diversity of content would add value.  That's how sites like this evolve for the better. 

Meanwhile....

Myriam Nicole taking first and absolutely crushing it at the World Cup in Lošinj, Croatia

 

losinj-finals.jpg

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17 hours ago, SallyCat said:

Really, NMS? Pinup pictures of scantily-clad female athletes and comments about which ones you want to "mount"?

WTF?

 

 

I'm only going to say one thing. I went through the thread and there are roughly 38 photos/videos posted in it. Of those, less than a 1/3 are what I would consider a pinup picture, let alone anything close to resembling porn. On forums that are mostly male, you'll always have threads like this that can quickly devolve to the point that they get binned by the mods. I have to say we do a pretty good job of keeping it clean and on topic. What did you expect when you clicked on the link to view the thread?

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Back on topic. Fort William this weekend! I'm rooting for Myriam Nicole. Go Pompon! Please don't do this:

5.jpg

That is from the Fort William race in 2015. Pinkbike has a DH fantasy league with some pretty cool prizes.

 

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]
 
**EDIT: Sorry, I got AZ and NMS confused there, probably because there wasn't much difference. The ass shots were on AZ, but there were plenty of equally-charmless pics and comments on NMS. 
 
@sallycat I just went through this entire thread and there is exactly one comment that is "derogatory" and two that are of ones personal preferences. The site as a whole is miles above AZ and for that matter TGR when it comes to appropriateness. I have met a dozen from the site and the are good guys and very much into skiing and outdoor activities. There is a lot of good here. And even the occasional poster is welcome and can contribute to building the forum.



Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

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I am so sick and tired of people getting offended by what other people do.  I am trying to hold back on this and it is so hard but I am.

My posting pics of women in various forms does not mean I do not respect women.  I just happen to find women attractive.  

If you find that offensive than do not click.

 

I guess being a heterosexual male that finds women attractive is offensive.

Edited by Puck it
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5 hours ago, Puck it said:

If you find that offensive than do not click

Personally, I don't click on threads that do not interest me or that I find offensive.  But the thread title "Women of MTB" gives no indication of either action photos or pin-up style photos of women.   And when I clicked on the thread titled "Eye candy"  I honestly was expecting to see photos of snow dumping in Australia, or a new line of skis, or....    well, you get the drift. 

FWIW I don't think offense was taken to either your gender or your sexual persuasion.  It just happens that some people do not want to be privy to your attractions, or anyone else's,  and were not expecting to encounter them on a mountain sports forum. (And this is where I feel like I should say something wise ass like  "No offense, it's nothing personal.")

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1 hour ago, Ski-kiki said:

Personally, I don't click on threads that do not interest me or that I find offensive.  But the thread title "Women of MTB" gives no indication of either action photos or pin-up style photos of women.   And when I clicked on the thread titled "Eye candy"  I honestly was expecting to see photos of snow dumping in Australia, or a new line of skis, or....    well, you get the drift. 

FWIW I don't think offense was taken to either your gender or your sexual persuasion.  It just happens that some people do not want to be privy to your attractions, or anyone else's,  and were not expecting to encounter them on a mountain sports forum. (And this is where I feel like I should say something wise ass like  "No offense, it's nothing personal.")

 

Telling someone "Don't click if you don't like it" is absurd logic; how are you supposed to know what the content is until you click on it? What Puck it is really saying is "Let me say and do whatever I want with no negative response ever, because anyone who disagrees with me has just gone mad with PC." These are tough times for the patriarchy. I mean dang it why should he have to consider the existence of people who aren't him?  

 

 

 

Edited by SallyCat
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15 minutes ago, SallyCat said:

 

Telling someone "Don't click if you don't like it" is absurd logic; how are you supposed to know what the content is until you click on it? What Puck it is really saying is "Let me say and do whatever I want with no negative response ever, because anyone who disagrees with me has just gone mad with PC." These are tough times for the patriarchy. I mean dang it why should he have to consider the existence of people who aren't him?  

 

 

 

Yup, PC is out of control.  I don't care you disagree with me, but if I want to post pics or comments then it is my perogative.  Just stay out of the thread now.

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21 hours ago, SallyCat said:

Indeed, photos are subjective. For example, when I look at this photo of a woman wearing full makeup and taking her clothes off in a Flashdance-style rain storm that was taken from an article called "The World's Hottest Pro Cyclist," and that wouldn't be out of place on the front page of PornHub, I see a powerful athlete, too.  But I see a one whose athleticism is being deliberately diminished by a media culture that thinks the only way the general public will value female athletes is as objects of sexual attraction.  Frankly, that's insulting not just to the athletes, but to their fans, as well. 

315201988_WomenofMTBPic4.jpg.a1773cf8428c28af32ba87e02721e510.jpg

I agree totally unnecessary, and maybe this attitude contributes the lack of women on these forums. These forums need to broaden their user base. 

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1 hour ago, Benski said:

I agree totally unnecessary, and maybe this attitude contributes the lack of women on these forums. These forums need to broaden their user base. 

Then stay out the thread if you don't like. I am suppose not post something because it might offend someone. Then why post anything at all.

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1 hour ago, Puck it said:

Yup, PC is out of control.  I don't care you disagree with me, but if I want to post pics or comments then it is my perogative.  Just stay out of the thread now.

You seem nice.

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You seem nice.
Oh good, you decided to stay! Still looking forward to seeing some quality content posted from you on this site about the stuff you do like (not just about stuff you don't like). Summer is always tough on these sites so could use your contributions now more than ever. For example, any good MTB rides lately? We could use more riding trip reports.

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22 minutes ago, Cannonballer said:
4 hours ago, SallyCat said:
You seem nice.

Oh good, you decided to stay! Still looking forward to seeing some quality content posted from you on this site about the stuff you do like (not just about stuff you don't like). Summer is always tough on these sites so could use your contributions now more than ever. For example, any good MTB rides lately? We could use more riding trip reports.

Not staying, just lurking for a while.  The exchanges here prompted me to work on a project about women's participation in outdoor-focused online communities, so I have an interest in sticking around a bit longer to see how the comments on this particular thread shake out.  Like many women, I find that male-dominated sites often turn out to be unwelcoming or just unpleasant places to hang around; at best, they fall into the "not worth it" category and women participants simply fade away. 

Here's one example of why that's a shame: What you call the "stuff I don't like" I don't like for reasons that are pretty important to me, and that have an impact on my day-to-day life. It seems unfair to criticize a person for being "negative" about things that are actually causing them harm. This might be easier to understand if there were more women here because instead of one outlier voice that is easily marginalized, you might have seen some common themes expressed in sheer numbers that would have been more compelling.

Anyway, I'll hang around a bit and then take Puck it's charming advice and get lost. 

 

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